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If you’re talking about the ones from the old website… those forums were nuked in the migration. I can sticky a new “introduce yourself” thread of you like.
Dude I’m not trying to “win”. I’m just struggling to figure out if there’s something wrong with the ship balance -and how to fix it if there is.
“Balance” can be very subjective, and my point of view is also going to be skewed by my own play style, goals, and skills.
I’m sorry if I’m being overly defensive about the game; I just want to get it right. I don’t think I’ve gone overboard with the introduction of so many ships, but I’m open to that possibility…
But it might simply be a “thematic” issue- that I haven’t effectively explained why the ships are balanced the way they are. Perhaps I’m relying too heavily on the ships to speak for themselves when in fact, they aren’t as self-apparent to others as they are to me.
For example, not everyone else will pick up on the nostalgia factor behind including the RWAR, CON-II, D-11 etc, or see any value in giving every Klingon the same WE/IE. I suppose to a new player, these things might just seem redundant when they haven’t been properly explained.
lol I get it man. We’ve been going in circles with this for a while. I was j/k about the sphere/rwar, but seriously, take a moment to consider:
It isn’t illogical or wrong for other players to want to play the game differently from the way you play. Not everyone has the same strategies, the same goals, or the same skills. So I should hope that it’s conceivable to you, that another player’s experience in a particular class might be wholly different from your own.
For example, you’ve been pretty vocal against the AVG-IX, and you’ve made it clear enough that you don’t care for it. That’s perfectly fine. On the other hand, Pete has logged 11+ hours and earned nearly 75K over the past week or so in an AVG. I can’t speak for him, but he did call it a “great ship” a few posts back. Is he wrong? Are you? Is anyone?
Your generalization of the WB vs RWAR vs KPB vs D7 vs D-11 vs KEV vs Vorcha- is basically the same discussion as the Borgs all over again. I don’t feel like spelling out the individual merits of each class right now, but suffice it to say, there are merits to every one of those ships. And even though you can’t see a reason why anyone would fly X instead of Y, someone else might.
Not everyone would agree with me on this (you obviously don’t), but I think it’s fantastic that there are so many ships, and I actually like that some of them offer only subtle variations across a spectrum of ship-designs. (WB/RWAR – Br5/Br6 – BR1K/BR2K – KEV/D7/D-11/Vorcha). I think it’s really cool that ships of the same species share some of the same archetypes. The variants, to me at least, give the ships slightly different personalities, but a Klingon still feels like a Klingon, an Orion still feels like an Orion, and a Rommie still feels like a Rommie… I also think it’s neat that different species offer their own versions of similar ships to fill certain “roles” in the game (KEV/Galaxy – Larson/Galor – RBOP/GBOP – Valdore/V’Shar).
Quit trying to rule out which ship is “obsolete” or “inferior” simply because there’s another like it, or because it’s an older design… If nothing else, look at it like buying cars, and you can afford as many cars as you like. Maybe the Federation is Ford, the Klingons are Dodge, and the Romulans are Chevy. Chevy doesn’t need to redesign the Camaro into a pickup truck because you’d rather drive a Mustang, any more than Ford needs to discontinue the Mustang because they built a pickup truck with a Ford V8 engine. If you own a construction business, don’t complain that you can’t fit enough lumber into a compact car. Instead, buy a truck and let the accountant guy enjoy decent gas mileage on his way to work. Maybe on the weekend, you could cruise around in a 1972 Gorn Firebird.
Build your fleet to suit your style. Maybe you have a thing for Rommies. Or maybe you like fast ships, but you’re crap without a cloak. If you don’t care about DamageGiven/DamageReceived-Ratio and Gold doesn’t particularly interest you, maybe you should stick to the easier RWAR, while somebody else flies the slightly more powerful, but also more challenging Warbird- and cashes in on the 20% more gold that it earns.
It doesn’t have to make sense. Otherwise, the game would have only a single perfect ship class. “Good morning, Captain! Welcome aboard the USS Ship, a Ship class Starship!”
Please let me know if I’m completely missing the mark here, but my focus on ship balance really boils down to answering a few questions about each ship:
- Is this ship playable? (Could an average-skill player have a reasonable chance at achieving a typical goal for this specific ship)
- Could someone be entertained by playing this ship? (NOT necessarily “Are you entertained”. Maybe you can’t hit squat with plasma or maybe you can’t control a ship faster than warp 14. If someone else can, the answer might still be yes)
- Are the other classes still worthwhile to fly? (A litmus test to see if the ship is “OP”. Is this class just so incredible, that it would be painfully difficult or even impossible to achieve similar results in a different class?)
- Are there any other ships that can operate in the game without getting completely wrecked by this one? (assuming both pilots are of a similar skill level)
Ideally, the answer should be “yes” to all of those questions, and then it’s just fine tuning from there.
Perhaps those two ships just aren’t well suited for your particular play style… because you know, neither one them is named “Sphere” or “RWAR”… Amiright?
Besides, if the owner of a certain 138K Warbird and a 40K D7 were to log in and see those ships gone… well, you wouldn’t have to answer for it- but I would. And I don’t really want to have that conversation right now haha
Tested: DKORA
In true Ferengi fashion, the D’Kora isn’t the most powerful ship in its speed category, but it does have a nice gold earning bonus to help make up for that.
If you time your shots well, you can make those plasma bolts really count. It doesn’t have cloak, but the ultra-low visibility and warp 15 cruising speed give you an element of surprise against a lot of ships. (Though I think the Vis will really only matter much in PvP.)
I didn’t think the DK was super-easy to fly, but I was probably being overly aggressive with it. However, with a slightly more cautious hit-and-run strategy, I do think it’s capable of reaching the top levels of the scoreboard.
I found myself wishing I had more torps a few times, but in general, it felt like a well-sorted ship and its limitations were apparent from the start. The disruptors deal full damage out to 700 range, so there’s really no need to go much closer than that. I found that a macro to fire bolts and phasers together was useful, as well as perhaps a couple of warp 11-14 bolt firing macros. I think I was running bolt macros for 11, 13, & 15.
Bolts only deal about 1/2 the *STRUCTURAL* damage of a standard plasma, so to help make up for this, I would try to find ways to slow the target down enough so I could switch over to regular and earn more points / deal more damage. I would use maybe half of the torps as bolts mixed with phasers, and then move in just close enough so the bot would phaser me. Depending on the class, that would normally do the trick so I could finish it off with plasma.
I figured out quickly that most obliterator-equipped ships should just be avoided, and that the D’Kora really can’t handle itself well against teams. Unfortunately, if you’ve just killed a ship (or nearly killed it) you’ll probably end up sacrificing the gold if another predator comes along.
Overall, I’d say the D’Kora is quirky and gold-driven enough the be worthy as a Ferengi. Performance-wise, I’d say it’s somewhere in the middle of the pack, and is neither overpowered nor underpowered. I found it to be an entertaining ship, and a player that does well with fast ships like the BR-5/6 or the Romulan Interceptor, will probably make a fortune in a D’Kora. I don’t see any adjustments needed here at all.
Tested: VORCHA
The Klingon Vor’Cha has always been one of the more powerful ships in the game. For 6.0 that hasn’t changed. All of the ships received a buff of some sort, and the Vor’Cha is no different. There’s nothing apparent on the ship specs chart, but in fact, the regen-rate of the oblits has been increased to 1-per-second. So given enough time, the Vor’Cha is capable of detonating nearly any ship, even with only 3 oblit tubes. The speed and scan range combine to give the player almost full control over which ships are targeted, and I found it possible to dominate even crowded areas like Delta Vega.
The hull and shield are decent, but given the (relatively) limited torpedo range, the small number of tubes, and the slow regen-rate of the 40-second cloak, you have to be willing to take some damage in the process of killing your targets. If you try to deal out death on pace commensurate with your torp-regen, you might find yourself (as I did) fighting full-power ships when you have 70+ damage. The Vor’Cha simply can’t heal damage fast enough to keep up with torp/xtal reloading. The Vor’Cha is absolutely a bot-slayer, but it might not fare quite so well against a skilled human. Still, I think it might be somewhat Overpowered. Pushing it to its limits, I eventually got myself killed though so there’s that…
Even if it’s a little overpowered, I’m not sure that it needs to be nerfed; I don’t forsee the Vor’Cha becoming the only ship to fly when there are so many other good ships to use. It isn’t a world-killer and there are plenty of ways to counter it if another (human) player comes after you in it.
It’s all good man. Just messing with you.
As for the Canonball map, I’m kicking around ideas for an mid-year expansion, possibly mission based, that revolves around the Borg and Delta Quadrant. One idea includes a variant of that map, but reskinned to be more Delta Quad-ish.
Tested: BR-5 & BR-1000
Really no surprises with either of these. Both ships are basically “easy mode”.
- The BR-5 proved adept at picking off bots that stray away from the herd. The speed and cloak remains effective as always at punching holes through the AI to score some easy kills. Being a warp 16 ship, it was really only in danger when I let it be. There’s not much to say about this one.
- The BR-1000 was enjoyable to fly for what it is. I think the most “profitable” way to operate it, is to use it as intended- that is, buzz around dumping torps on targets with the super long torp range and only move in close for a kill if a good opportunity presents itself. The only encounter that worried me was once in Beta quad when a D’Kora caught me out in space with only 20 torps. It could have ended badly for me had I been completely empty, but as it was, I managed to do a little damage before making it burn warp to get in close. I ran in for a phaser/mine which gave the DK just enough damage to make it run. The Gold bonus all Orions receive was more than enough to make up for the cautious play style needed for the BR1K, and firing only torps at no-score ships still returned a decent profit.
I’m ok with both of these as they are.
I’m not sure that song means what you think it means…
As I understand it, John Lennon is professing his (present) romantic love for “cannonball(delta map)” [sic] by reminiscing over all of his most cherished memories in life and asserting that his (present) romantic love for “cannonball(delta map)” [sic] is even greater than his already immense love for all of the people, things, and places in those memories.
Or maybe that’s precisely the message you’re trying to convey, and in that case, cheer up bro, because that means you’ll still have room in your heart to fall deeply (and romantically hahaha) in love with mtrek.com’s Software Version 6.X.
That said, I might ask that this song is played at my funeral, just to make sure everybody has a good cry.
(Note on Canonball spelling: The map layout was nicknamed “Canonball” with one n between a and o instead of nn which isn’t exactly an intentional misspelling, but rather a new word altogether; “Canon” is referring to Star Trek canon, and not to the large caliber gun that fires “cannonballs”. The second part of the name, “ball” was simply pointing out the circular array of the map.)
R.I.P. 5.X 2015-2016
P.S. I doubt we’ve seen the last of the Canonball map…
Tested: GALOR, BR-2000, and CDA-120
- The Galor (obviously) bears a striking resemblance to the Ferengi in terms of form and function. However, the extra torp range and the regenerating mine open up the possibility of killing more ships, while the long scan range paired with low-visibility (75) give you a nice leg-up on situational awareness. There were a couple of tense moments but in general, I felt in control of the battlefield most of the time. I would certainly consider the Galor to fill a similar role to that of the Larson as a versatile, aggressive “slayer”. Thanks to the ESI and the regen mine, I think it would be especially useful against slower cloaking ships and it would probably rank near the top of my list for PvP.
- The BR-2000 was a little challenging at first, but once I settled into a nice groove, I found it very rewarding to fly. I think the trouble was that I had grown accustomed to more “rugged” ships, and it took a bit of an adjustment on my part to be conscious of the relatively weak hull & shields. I found that the key was to accept that I can’t kill every target I go after in one torp load, and sometimes it was best to use the long torp range to deliver torps, and then simply leave to reload. The warp 14 was plenty to keep me out of trouble most of the time, but I was wary of faster ships like the D’Kora or the Interceptor. I didn’t have an opportunity to test this theory, but I felt like this is probably a great ship to beat a KEV-12. Full power and in open space, I have little doubt that I could kill one in PvP using the BR-2000. If I have a load of torps and you’re in a Sphere, just go ahead and xwarp.
- The CDA-120 felt very familiar, and works like basically a lighter, faster Galor. The current 120 is almost identical to the mtrek.pro and 4.x versions, with a regen mine and the ability to heal to its max of 120 Warp Energy. The hull is durable enough to get dirty in a fight and put the ESI to good use, and the Variable-Speed drones can punish a target that fails to zap them. On the flip side, if your opponent is zapping your drones, that means they have less energy to shoot you with, so it’s really win/win. The 10k scan range, 85 Visibility, and warp 14 gave me the initiative most of the time, but as with other non-cloakers, I had to be mindful of the faster Int/DK and the BR-5/6s. All-in-all, it’s a fun ship, and it has a lot of potential as a PvP ship. (Look out, Galaxys!)
In other news:
I flew the Ferengi for an hour…
And it’s a good ship!
It isn’t very lethal, and in fact, I found myself running away (overwarping) from more powerful ships on several occasions. I was actually kind of getting beat up. There were some tense moments as my damage crept over 100 a few times. It never seemed to have enough torps, and being mindful not to ESI my own drones turned out to be an important part of my strategy if I had any hope of scoring a kill.
Early in my session, I was being cheap and I didn’t bother getting xtals because it felt like it had enough energy with its low warp cost. After using long bursts of warp 16 to bring down an Orion or escape certain death (which was more often the case) I decided that staying alive is worth the expense and seconds spent refueling.
And then there’s the gold. Ahhhh that glorious MTrek gold… The thing that makes this ship worthwhile to fly, is its nice gold earning rate. Because that whole time I was getting slapped around by bigger ships, I was dealing some damage too. And the Ferengi have ways of swindling a premium out of the starbases when it’s time to pay up. I even managed to set a couple of gold-earning records on the stats page. (#3 for Gold/Second and #10 for Gold/Conflict)
I was enjoying an entirely new style of play (for me) with my usual priorities on their head. 1st: Survival. 2nd: Try to deal some damage. 3rd: Maybe get a kill here and there. I was targeting bots based on how many points of damage I might be able to deal or how much bonus I would earn over how much gold they were carrying.
I felt like I was struggling a lot with this class, but every time I docked, I couldn’t help but smile when I raked in some more gold. I don’t think I’ve even realized the full potential of this ship yet, but I think it’s already earned a spot in my “core” fleet alongside my CL, RBoP, and II-A.
